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(Comparative) study (in structure/mode/ways of pronunciation, articulation, phonetics, or whatever; that is, in differences of speaking mouth postures and resultant speaking weight/force center points) between English/foreign languages and mother tongue, for better (more practical/effective/smooth) hearing/speaking of English/foreign languages.       Copyright.   Young-Won Kim,   yw@voicespec.com
open : home | main | Kor | book | FUN member : main II | Kor II


::: Comparative phonetics, brd2 :::


90 11 View counter   Join Member Login Admin
Name   Young-Won Kim
Subject   Professor Wolfgang Hess, Universität Bonn.
----- Original Message -----
From: Wolfgang Hess
To: 김용완
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2007 6:26 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: Uni-Stuttgart.de/phonetik

Dear Mr Kim,

why are you spamming the whole phonetics and linguistics community in Germany with this junk?         In my view this is highly unfair. If you want to get into discussion with my colleagues in Stuttgart, there are plenty of possibilities to do so. One of them is via their website.

Kind regards
Wolfgang Hess

----------------------------------------------------------------
Wolfgang Hess, Professor
Sprache und Kommunikation
Institut für Kommunikationswissenschaften, Universität Bonn
Poppelsdorfer Allee 47, D-53115 Bonn, Germany

Prorektor für Lehre, Studium und Studienreform, Universität Bonn

phone +49(228)735638 and -5637; fax +49(228)735639
e'mail: wgh@ifk.uni-bonn.de [NEW!]  Web: http://www.ikp.uni-bonn.de

Archive Coordinator, International Speech Communication Assoc. (ISCA)
ISCA website: http://www.isca-speech.org
----------------------------------------------------------------


김용완 wrote:
----- Original Message -----
From: ygwnkm
To:
Sent: Monday, March 12, 2007 3:10 PM
Subject: Uni-Stuttgart.de/phonetik
http://www.ims.uni-stuttgart.de/phonetik/EGG/page1.htm,        
http://www.ims.uni-stuttgart.de/phonetik/,      
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonetics,    
Many themes/contents of the above sites are improper for understanding/study of phonetics/pronunciation/etc., I think.    
So, I invite/challenge people of “Uni-Stuttgart.de/phonetik” to my forum board http://www.voicespec.com/  (or somewhere else?).     I will publicize this invitation/challenge, if you do not respond in a week.    
Young-Won Kim
ygwnkm@yahoo.co.kr   ygwnkm@hotmail.com
http://www.voicespec.com/board.cgi?id=test1
http://www.voicespec.com/
Phonetik in Deutschland:
• Aachen
      • Berlin
      • Bonn
      • Dresden
      • Erlangen
      • Freiburg

• Halle
      • Jena
      • Kiel
      • Köln
      • Konstanz
      • Marburg

• München
      • Potsdam
      • Saarbrücken
      • Stuttgart
      • Trier
      • Tübingen
      • (Jemanden vergessen?)



= = = = = = = = = =


----- Original Message -----
From: ygwnkm
To: wgh@ifk.uni-bonn.de
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 10:35 AM
Subject: phonetics and linguistics community in Germany

Dear Wolfgang Hess:

Did you send the reply e-mail Tuesday, MAY 15, 2007 6:26 PM?
As you see, I received it JULY 23, 2007.    

>> why are you spamming the whole phonetics and linguistics community in Germany with this JUNK?

* Many (maybe phonetics) people of world visit my page of http://www.voicespec.com/,     which eventually means they think my e-mail is not junk but informative.    

>> In my view this is highly unfair. If you want to get into discussion with my colleagues in Stuttgart, there are plenty of possibilities to do so. One of them is via their website.


* Please let me know their website/address of homepage/etc.

Kind regards
Young-Won Kim
ygwnkm@yahoo.co.kr   ygwnkm@hotmail.com
http://www.voicespec.com/board.cgi?id=test1
http://www.voicespec.com/



= = = = = = = = = = =


----- Original Message -----
From: Wolfgang Hess
To: ygwnkm
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 8:42 PM
Subject: Re: phonetics and linguistics community in Germany

>> ygwnkm wrote:
Did you send the reply e-mail Tuesday, MAY 15, 2007 6:26 PM?
As you see, I received it JULY 23, 2007.  

*  Dear Mr Kim,
indeed I sent this message in May. Apparently there were problems with a mail server because I got messeges from a couple of other sites that some mail of mine which I send in mid-May have been delayed for two months.

>> Many (maybe phonetics) people of world visit my page of   http://www.voicespec.com/,     which eventually means they think my e-mail is not junk but informative.    

* Before I wrote this mail, I checked your webpage voicespec.com, and I also checked with my colleagues from Stuttgart whom I know rather well. The reason why I was upset about this mail is that it went to literally all researchers at any institute of phonetics in Germany accusing the Stuttgart colleagues of improper phonetic work.

I indeed found your webpage www.voicespec.com uninformative because it
contains what you say about my Stuttgart colleagues, i.e., improper work. I give
an example at the end of this mail. What I found informative was the completeness
of your list of German researchers.

>> Please let me know their website/address of homepage/etc.

* http://www.ims.uni-stuttgart.de/phonetik/ . You find the contact addresses of
the staff in this website. By the way, this address was already contained in your table.


This is an example from www.voicespec.com


“How do English irregular verbs/plurals have come into being?”


1. Irregular verbs.
Re: the article of “Phonetics is environmental.”   <<Column 4>>
Re: the article of “Digraph “-ea-””   <<Column 2>>
http://www2.gsu.edu/~wwwesl/egw/verbs.htm ,
http://www.englishpage.com/irregularverbs/irregularverbs.html ,  
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Wiktionary_Appendix:Irregular_verbs:English ,  

Pronunciations (in/with English speaking posture of cp/bp) of “-ed” regular forms (of base forms) of/for irregular verbs (seem to) be (rough/nearly) equal/similar to the spellings   (rather than pronunciation/sounds, paradoxically)   of irregular verbs;       that is, irregular verbs (seem to) be simply   (the English-most-possibly/rough-same/similar/near)   spellings of/for metaphthong sound/pronunciations themselves of “-ed” regular forms of those (irregular) verbs.    


# To me this sentence is simply unintelligible. And it goes on like this ...

    
** To all hearing/appearances, English-mother-tongue people seem to articulate/condition “goed, caned, haved, buyed, speaked, etc.”          rather than “went/gone, could, had, bought, spoke/spoken, etc.”        ** haved [h(iæ)v  v/ŋ=d  (d=)]  >>  had;     buyed [bΛy  y/ŋ=d  (d/t=)]  >>  bought [b(ou)g  - -];      goed   [(ŋ)uent]/[g(oΛ)=  ŋ=n]  >>  went/gone;    “bended  >>  bent”;      ** “crown  >>  k(h)rawn” **      

I'm not a historical linguist,   but as far as I know many of the Indo-European
languages have irregular verbs (e.g. English, German, French, Italian, Spanish,
classical Latin, Greek, Polish, Russian).   Our morphology (not only for verbs) allows multiple forms, and it depends on an individual lexeme which form it adopts when it is inflected.      In addition, some irregular verbs are mergers from more than one older verbs.      A classical example for this is the French verb "aller" -to go- which is a merger of three verbs from classical Latin:

Latin ambulare (to walk around) >> French aller - nous allons (we go) - j'allais (I went - imperfect past tense)
ire (to go) >> j'irai (future tense)
vadere (to go forward) >> je vais (I go - present tense) - il va (he goes)

>> In/with English speaking posture of cp/bp, speaking/articulation/pronunciation of “had” is impossible at all, I experience/find,     though “have/haved/hadd” are possible.         * “had” itself cannot be vector/articulated with English speaking posture of cp/bp at all         irregardless whether the word of “had” is phoneme/word-mechanically/mechanistically/structurally(??)/whatever  possible/proper or impossible/improper;      that is, if “had” of word/phoneme structure/array/combination is once tried to speak with English speaking posture of cp/bp, the mouth will soon be stiffen/paralyzed.          

# Poor English people!! I am German but almost every day exposed to spoken English.
Never, ever have I heard somebody speaking "goed" or "buyed".      "Had" is much easier to articulate than "haved" (which I never heard either),     and I cannot imagine that anybody would get a knot in the tongue from articulating "had".     There is only one may-be difficulty.      We Germans have final devoicing (I think Korean has it too),   so we would tend to pronounce "had" like "hat".       But this is a thing one learns in a vary early stage of learning English or French,     and once learned, you get easily used to it.

So, as we Germans say, sweeping at one's own door first would be a good thing rather than writing to the whole community in Germany telling them that the Stuttgart colleagues do improper work.

Kind regards,
Wolfgang Hess


----------------------------------------------------------------
Wolfgang Hess, Professor
Sprache und Kommunikation
Institut für Kommunikationswissenschaften, Universität Bonn
Poppelsdorfer Allee 47, D-53115 Bonn, Germany

Prorektor für Lehre, Studium und Studienreform, Universität Bonn

phone +49(228)735638 and -5637; fax +49(228)735639
e'mail: wgh@ifk.uni-bonn.de [NEW!]  Web: http://www.ikp.uni-bonn.de

Archive Coordinator, International Speech Communication Assoc. (ISCA)
ISCA website: http://www.isca-speech.org

= = = = = = = = = = =


----- Original Message -----
From: ygwnkm
To: wgh@ifk.uni-bonn.de
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 12:01 PM
Subject: PHONETICS: one's own door first

Dear Prof/Mr. Wolfgang Hess:

* I do not believe in IPA chart.      I can speak vowels without using of the tongue,    which most people agree with.      You (and most phonetics/phonology professors) seem to be IPA follower though.


>> The reason why I was upset about this mail is that it went to literally all researchers at any institute of phonetics in Germany accusing the Stuttgart colleagues of improper phonetic work.


* I think phonetics is very important to learn/speak/hear foreign languages.    I am now publicize/advertising that the phonetics/phonology/etc. of most universities/IPA/etc. is wrong/harmful.    


>> I'm not a historical linguist, but as far as I know many of the Indo-European
languages have irregular verbs (e.g. English, - - - .

* I explain English irregular verbs (not historically but) phonetically.


>> Poor English people!! I am German but almost every day exposed to spoken English.        Never, ever have I heard somebody speaking "goed" or "buyed". "Had" is much easier to articulate than "haved" (which I never heard either),    and I cannot imagine that anybody would get a knot in the tongue from articulating "had". There is only one may-be difficulty.    We Germans have final devoicing (I think Korean has it too), so we would tend to pronounce "had" like "hat".    But this is a thing one learns in a vary early stage of learning English or French, and once learned, you get easily used to it.


* Speaking (mouth) postures (of cp/bp) are always different among languages;     so, English-mother-tongue people can not directly speak (and do not have official phonemes of) “ü/ö/etc. of German” if they do not take German-speaking (mouth) posture (of cp/bp).    And German-mother-tongue people can not directly speak (and do not have official phonemes of) “ð/θ” if they do not change speaking (mouth) posture (of cp/bp).             I argue that the action of speaking follows the theory of “conditional reflection”.        Condition (for speaking) is equal to articulation (in the mouth/chest articulation circles)     and reflection/vibration/pronunciation (of voice production) is occurred on the hemi-diaphragms, which I can feel.    

And I can feel/say that English-mother-tongue people condition/articulate "goed" or "buyed" so as to reflect/pronounce [uent] or [bΛy  y/ŋ=d  (d/t=)]    rather than “went/bought” of GRECONGLISH.         “went/bought” can be articulate/spoken with other (maybe Greek/GRECONGLISH/etc.) speaking (mouth) posture (of cp/bp) than English.


>> So, as we Germans say, sweeping at one's own door first would be
a good thing rather than writing to the whole community in Germany telling
them that the Stuttgart colleagues do improper work.


* When other doors are dirty,   it is not sufficient that one's own door is clean,     in order to have clean village/community.       We need healthy/right phonetics for successful/good speaking/hearing of foreign languages.     Even illiterate people can speak/hear their mother tongue.     Phonetics is really necessary for foreign-language learning (of other doors or world community/village) rather than mother tongue (of one's own door).
Why not study speaking (mouth) postures (of cp/bp)??       CONDITION/REFLECTION


Kind regards,
Young-Won Kim
ygwnkm@yahoo.co.kr   ygwnkm@hotmail.com
http://www.voicespec.com/

----- Original Message -----
From: Wolfgang Hess
To: ygwnkm
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 8:42 PM
Subject: Re: phonetics and linguistics community in Germany

Kind regards
Wolfgang Hess
<!--[if !supportLineBreakNewLine]-->
<!--[endif]-->
----------------------------------------------------------------
Wolfgang Hess, Professor
Sprache und Kommunikation
Institut für Kommunikationswissenschaften, Universität Bonn
Poppelsdorfer Allee 47, D-53115 Bonn, Germany
 
Prorektor für Lehre, Studium und Studienreform, Universität Bonn
 
phone +49(228)735638 and -5637; fax +49(228)735639
e'mail: wgh@ifk.uni-bonn.de [NEW!]  Web: http://www.ikp.uni-bonn.de
 
Archive Coordinator, International Speech Communication Assoc. (ISCA)
ISCA website: http://www.isca-speech.org
----------------------------------------------------------------

Send this message to email View Printable version
DATE: 2007.08.15 - 12:12

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27Simple viewroot of (all) grammars; phonetics.      SWEDEN,       Bielefeld/ GERMANY Y... 2007.11.28
26Simple viewroot of (all) grammars; phonetics.         GERMANY Y... 2007.11.21
25Simple viewgrammars:     upenn,    ucla, Y... 2007.11.07
24Simple viewJames Mesbur/upenn Y... 2007.11.07
23Simple viewthe structure/principle of trumpet Y... 2007.11.07
22Simple viewDiaphragm/phonetics Y... 2007.11.07
21Simple viewyale,  purdue,  uchicago,  stanford,  nyu,  umich,  hawaii,  harvard,  uoregon Y... 2007.09.19
20Simple viewLinguistList,    Wikipedia Y... 2007.11.08
19Simple viewNorway; @hf.ntnu, @nor.uib, @iln.uio, @hum.uit, Y... 2007.08.07
18Simple viewFinland; @helsinki, @joensuu, @campus.jyu, @oulu, @uta, @utu, @uwasa, @abo, Y... 2007.08.07
17Simple view@rice.edu, @ku.edu, @byu.edu, @msu.edu, @gsu.edu, @berkeley.edu, Y... 2007.07.19
16Simple view@udel, @ucsc, @mit, @indiana, @mail.utexas, @cornell, Y... 2007.07.02
15Simple view18th International Congress of Linguists Y... 2007.06.18
14Simple view@u.washington ; @u.arizona; @ling.ohio-state  Y... 2007.06.18
13Simple viewCanadian phonetics Y... 2007.06.06
12Simple viewBritish phonetics Y... 2007.05.15
11Simple viewPhonetics, Sweden, uu.se, umu.se, su.se, kth.se, gu.se Y... 2007.05.15
10Simple viewUSC phonetics Y... 2007.04.13
9Simple viewPhonetics of Lund University, Sweden Y... 2007.03.23
8Simple viewUni-Stuttgart.de/phonetik Y... 2007.03.23
7Simple viewPhonetik in Deutschland Y... 2007.05.25
6Now readingProfessor Wolfgang Hess, Universität Bonn. Y... 2007.08.15
5Simple viewUCLA Phonetics Y... 2007.03.12
4Simple viewChallenge to upenn phonetics/phonology Y... 2007.02.24
3Simple viewWhat kind of response are you expecting? New person/UPenn Y... 2007.02.24
2Simple viewthat of a reasonable academic, UPenn Y... 2007.02.24
1Simple viewUltimate knowledge. UPenn Y... 2007.03.02
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